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+-- Thread: Chipbreaker success (/showthread.php?tid=6447692)
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Re: Chipbreaker success - cputnam - 07-24-2013
Quote:
But for today's audience, adding in a little more information like, "You'll most likely need to be within 1/128" to 1/64" for smoothing," and "If you still get tearout, move the chipbreaker closer, and if the shaving comes out like an accordion, you can move it back," goes a long way towards making the information a lot easier to understand, especially if you are not seeing this in person.
Bravo! An object lesson in effective communication. Thank you.
Re: Chipbreaker success - Gregory of Sherwood Forest - 07-24-2013
CedarSlayer said:
My own process for fine tuning the gap, is to use a flat, smooth scraped, not sanded block of cedar to adjust the chip breaker. I will use a cutting gauge to make a light line in the cedar. with the blade edge in the cut line, I will push down the chip breaker and secure it in place. to adjust the gap, I may angle the blade and chip breaker. This method is mostly fool proof, which is why I use it. I use cedar because it is soft but not too soft. this can be done without scoring a line, but the line lets me reproduce the same gap on multiple sharpenings.
I like that!
Re: Chipbreaker success - Skewdge - 07-24-2013
CedarSlayer said:
...
My own process for fine tuning the gap, is to use a flat, smooth scraped, not sanded block of cedar to adjust the chip breaker. I will use a cutting gauge to make a light line in the cedar. with the blade edge in the cut line, I will push down the chip breaker and secure it in place...
Bob
Hi Bob thanks for sharing your method. It sounds like a nice trick. I hope i am not asking a dumb question, do you do all of that when the blade and the chip are in the dai? Do you have any pictures or would you be able to take some and demonstrate? I am interested in learning how the cp technique can be done in Japanese planes.
Steve, thanks for the link. Most good woodworking classes are always held either on the East coast or in California.
Re: Chipbreaker success - CedarSlayer - 07-24-2013
Early on, when adjusting a plane by hammer was hard, I decided to face learning to adjust dead on. If the plane blade got even slightly dull, I took it out and stropped it. This forced me to learn to adjust. Since then I still strop or sharpen at the first chance. The easiest to practice on was actually a Hong Kong Style, because of the screw together chip breaker and blade.
The one I have I think of as Japanese, but really it is a Hong Kong style. Probably a Mujingfang, My bad. When I adjust this one I can do it the way I described. I use it the most since I hate to use up my Japanese blades doing rough work. I keep them for finishing or fine finishing.
If the blade and the chipbreaker are not joined together with a screw, then you have to adjust them both by taping. this is still pretty easy. Light taps do the job, if you go too far you tap the back of the plane body till the blade is even with the sole of the plane and then tap the blade back into place. For me this almost always puts the chipbreaker where I want it. This is not automatic the way it is with the screw held chipbreaker, but it is still pretty easy.
For me, Japanese Planes seem to 'learn' where you want the blade. It could be my skill, but I don't think so. I think that when you plane with it in the right position, you wear a comfort zone into the dai that makes it easier to return the plane to that position.
Bob
Re: Chipbreaker success - Steve Friedman - 07-24-2013
CedarSlayer said:
I learned how to use a chip breaker on a Japanese Plane way before I figured out how to do it on a Western Plane.
Here are my tips and methods.
To test for proper contact, after sharpening the blade I will use a permanent marker on the back edge of the blade. I will then hold the chipbreaker down just before the edge of the blade and shift it forward. If this process takes off a smooth line of the marker, I know that the chipbreaker and blade are tuned to make solid contact near the edge.
My own process for fine tuning the gap, is to use a flat, smooth scraped, not sanded block of cedar to adjust the chip breaker. I will use a cutting gauge to make a light line in the cedar. with the blade edge in the cut line, I will push down the chip breaker and secure it in place. to adjust the gap, I may angle the blade and chip breaker. This method is mostly fool proof, which is why I use it. I use cedar because it is soft but not too soft. this can be done without scoring a line, but the line lets me reproduce the same gap on multiple sharpenings.
Bob
Thanks, that's brilliant, but simple. Never would have thought of that. I will definitely try it!
Steve
Re: Chipbreaker success - Steve Friedman - 07-24-2013
Skewdge said:
Steve, thanks for the link. Most good woodworking classes are always held either on the East coast or in California.
Except when they're in Iowa, Ohio, Kentucky, Indiana, or Minnesota.
But I get your point - I agree that there don't seem to be many in Texas. Isn't there a school in Waco?
Steve
Re: Chipbreaker success - Wilbur Pan - 07-24-2013
Hank Knight in SC said:
Thanks for posting this, Wilbur. I had taken the chip breaker off my blade and the retaining pin out of my kanna. It looks like I need to go put them back.
To be honest, I usually use my Japanese planes without the chipbreaker, or with the chipbreaker set so far back that it doesn't do anything besides look good.
I had mentioned that there are many other ways of dealing with tearout besides using a chipbreaker. I usually take the higher bed angle route. I have a Japanese plane with a bed angle of 45º instead of the usual 40º that most Japanese planes are set at, and if I have a board that is giving me problems, that's what I use. That plane has a chipbreaker as well, and I don't use it.
Re: Chipbreaker success - Wilbur Pan - 07-24-2013
Gregory of Sherwood Forest said:
Waitaminute.
The shaving coming out like an accordion is a bad thing??
There have been examples showing that to be the desired outcome and use it as proof that the chipbreaker is, in fact, breaking the chips.
My feeling is that you want the shaving to be just short of an accordion. There's nothing wrong with the shaving being like an accordion. It's just that one other effect of putting the chipbreaker closer is that it will make the plane harder to push, so if you get an accordion shaving, you're probably making the plane a little harder to use than it needs to be.
In the end, it's not what the shaving looks like, it's what the planed surface looks like.
Re: Chipbreaker success - Wilbur Pan - 07-24-2013
Steve Friedman said:
[blockquote]Skewdge said:
Wilbur
Thanks, finally a thread about some Japanese woodworking even though what you covered applies to all hand planes.
Where can I find more info about the class that you attended. Is there another one coming up in the near future?
Cheers
I'm not Wilbur, but assume he went to the class at Peters Valley in NJ. Here's the teaching schedule for the instructor - looks like it's just east coast:
Mokuchi
[/blockquote]
Yup. Peters Valley. It was a great time.
Re: Chipbreaker success - Wilbur Pan - 07-24-2013
Skewdge said:
[blockquote]CedarSlayer said:
...
My own process for fine tuning the gap, is to use a flat, smooth scraped, not sanded block of cedar to adjust the chip breaker. I will use a cutting gauge to make a light line in the cedar. with the blade edge in the cut line, I will push down the chip breaker and secure it in place...
Bob
Hi Bob thanks for sharing your method. It sounds like a nice trick. I hope i am not asking a dumb question, do you do all of that when the blade and the chip are in the dai? Do you have any pictures or would you be able to take some and demonstrate? I am interested in learning how the cp technique can be done in Japanese planes.
[/blockquote]
This is how I managed to use the chipbreaker on that piece of bubinga.
1. Set the plane to take as thin a shaving as I possibly could. The chipbreaker isn't set yet.
2. Take a shaving on a test piece of wood. I used a scrap piece of pine and planed against the grain. Observe the tearout.
3. Tap the chipbreaker down as close to the edge as I could. Looking down into the throat of a Japanese plane to do this is a real exercise in low-light vision. What worked for me was to look down into the throat of the plane. You'll see a black rectangle in front of the chipbreaker's edge that represents the back side of the plane blade that's not yet covered by the chipbreaker. This rectangle gets smaller as I tap the chipbreaker down. When the rectangle became a line, and then a very thin line, I stopped.
4. Take another shaving. If there isn't any tearout, declare victory. If there is tearout, tap the chipbreaker lightly and try again. Keep repeating until you get a tearout free shaving. At this point I'm not bothering to try to visualize how close the chipbreaker is to the edge. I'm just looking at the response of the shaving and the surface of the board.